The Mentoring Room - Ask the Working Pros

Ehm.... the rest of the world uses FCP? Wait for this:

http://www.avid.com/company/releases/2003/030107_AvidFreeDV_prod.html

Steve, you should see if there is some way (even a journey to
Vancouver or freebie downloads) to test out both Final Cut and Avid.
From my limited experience (I am not an editor), Final Cut has an
easier interface as an editing program if you have little editing
experience (and especially if you are interested in doing lots of
artsy overlay type effects), but, as a committed PC person who has
never found Macs more user-friendly, I knew that I had to get a
program that worked effectively on a PC so I invested in Avid XPress
DV. The main problem I've found with the Avid is that the
instruction manuals seem to presume the folks using it are
experienced with Avids and are simply new to having one at home. The
Final Cut instruction manuals I've seen don't presume you have any
editing experience.

STeve, maybe you could borrow someone's Mac and test out iMovie??
I've never used it but it comes free on Mac and whittles down editing
to the essentials.

For someone just getting into video, a 1-chip camera and iMovie (or
that new free Avid software Ben mentioned) would let your experiment
and have a lot of fun...

then after you've started up the learning curve, you'll have a better
idea of where to invest your money... fancier edit system, or fancier
camera (or both). Your 1-chip camera will always be handy to have...
you can use it to load footage instead of a deck later, e.g.

Also, for someone who is an artist/printmaker, I imagine the smaller
the camera the better... you can get more artistic and experiment
more... carry it w/ you everywhere... there's something about a more
expensive camera that might make you afraid to throw snow at it or
whatever...

Erica- there are so many "unofficial" editing manuals out there (for
FCP at least).. The bookstores here have whole sections of 'em. Did
you ever find an Avid manual to help you?

p.s. Steve, if you're wanting to do interviews, you will have to
invest in a microphone as well, eventually.

Thanks everyone for your time and info.. Margo,Is it possible to
combine footage shot with a one chip and a 3 chip..would the cheaper
camera be useful in that way in the future? After what you were
saying about the portability etc of the smaller camera, I'm thinkin'
yah..that could be good.

I know i have to get a microphone but I was leaving that for now
while I fretted about the system and camera etc. Is there a
particular microphone that one should get/avoid??

Man, this is so great to be able to get information like this..altho
if this list wasn't available I would probably have been overwhelmed
with the difficulty etc and gone quietly back to the brushes thus
saving myself much travail..not to mention money..

Does anyone have an opinion about the Pinnacle products? The fellow
I'm talking to about a computer is yakking up the Pinnacle capture
card and Adobe Premiere 6.5..

Once again, thanks for info and time

Steve

real quick, am running out door...

-You really want a Mac, not a PC clone, for what you wanna do.
Believe me.

-You don't need a capture card--if you get a Mac, you just plug the
DV camera into the computer (via Firewire) and you can load footage...
It's very simple. You don't need to know about Pinnacle cards, etc.

-Any level of new Macintosh computer (including laptops) and a cheap
DV camera (one-chip) will let you get started w/ what you wanna do.

-yes, you can combine 1-chip and 3-chip footage, no problem.

In terms of Final Cut Pro... you should look at a newer product
called Final Cut Express instead... it's way cheaper than FCP, and
omits all the crap you won't need anyway.

Margot, I am holding out for the Visual Quick Pro manual since the
one for Final Cut seemed to be pretty helpful. The Avid one was
supposed to come out by the end of 2002, then got pushed to April
2003, and now I see on Amazon, the release won't be until June.
Crap. My main issue is that my background is all in Media 100 and
Avid doesn't use the same terminology at all, so when I look up in
the manual or online guide something like "split clip," it doesn't
exist and I simply don't have the same sense of logic as whoever
created Avid to figure out its terminology. That said, I have
actually finished one simple piece for my office on the Avid, so I'm
hardly giving up on it yet. If anyone else here has any other
recommendations for good Avid XPress manuals, that would be welcome.
The online Avid User Forum is OK, but the interface is way too
unwieldy for the amount of questions generated there that good
responses are few and far between.

Yes, Robert, we really should have put the plug for your book. It is
essential reading.

Erica, if you have any questions about your XDV, you know where to
ask them... {LINK NOT IMPORTED}.... There's quite a bunch of Avid
editors among D-Worders.

Robert, your book has been on my Amazon wishlist for months. My
birthday is Tuesday. Hint hint. (But does it give translations from
Media 100 to Avid? I'm not using Final Cut.) And, of course, I know
I can always ask questions in the Community. Just didn't want to
come across as the dumb dumb Avid newbie that I am. A pride thing, I
guess. :-)

translations from m100 to Avid included.

super!

Thanks Margo, Erica, Robert et al...Your book is ordered Robert and I
will put off any further exploration until I have had a chance to
read it..thanks again all..

Steve

Hi ! We are an independant group who are making a documentary about
Eva Peron. We almost finished the 48 minutes version and now we are
contacting distributors and networks to sell it around the world.
Many of them just watched the trailer (posting on our web site) and
are asking for us to send them the full version to analyse it and
then send a proposal. My question is regarding of international
rights: We have regustered the documentary here in Argentina, but we
don´t know exactly how it works for the rest of the world, we should
register in every country ? Do we have to get any papel for export
the video ? We are not a company yet, so we have no idea how to
manage the commercial issues...
Thank you very much ! Maria

No need to register elsewhere, Maria. You license your film to
broadcasters on a territory by territory basis. Or you find a
distributor or sales agent who will contact the broadcasters.

Since you are intending to enter into contracts one way or the other,
I suggest that you form a company. Or, at the very least, you need a
lead producer who will sign any contracts on the group's behalf.
Sounds like a company might be better, if only to force your group to
come to terms with the business end of the biz.

and I wouldn't send anyone a tape -ever.
The purpose of a tape is to allow distributors
to say we saw that - it's no good. You
need to take the trailer to a market, show
em that only, and make a deal or not. No
deal no show. The alternative is to take
the completed doc to an A list festival
and win a prize. Then let them approach
you with a deal.

Sending tapes out is the kiss of DEATH!

I am currently completing an historical documentary and am having a
hard time locating guidelines for what to include in the credits and
in what order. Any resources or suggestions would be greatly
appreciated. Thanks.

there aren't any standards for credits. Suggest you look at a few
other films you admire - and copy.

Thanks. I have looked at a few and am trying to emulate them the
best I can.

wish i could ask some vaguely technical question so i wouldn't seem
out of place, but all i really need help with (and i REALLY DO need
help with) is an idea of where to start. What do i mean? Well, I have
an idea that i'd like to turn into a documentary, but in school kid
terms, i'm still in pre-school. In documentary terms,i can't speak
and have no teeth.

Where do i / should i go to find out how i might turn an idea that
i'm passionate about into a film? I need to know everything really -
technicalities, equipment / funding / story telling etc etc. Is a
passion for something and a creative eye enough to go on? Is formal
training totally neccersary?

All i can say is that i'm totally commited to fulfilling this project
and would love to get on with it. I'm based in London and would love
somebody to point me in the right direction.

Welcome, Rob. AIVF (Association of Independent Video and Filmmakers)
is an incredible resource for the beginning indie filmmaker. I
recommend you begin there, and check out their links:

http://aivf.org/resources/tips/aspiringfilmmaker.html

Lots of luck!

Thanks Doug - interesting.
I've been back through the postings, but is there a definitive line
on writing treatments? The obvious point (and one discussed
previously) is that its impossible to write something other than a
synopsis as your story (assuming its based on unfolding events)
hasn't happened yet.

Can anyone share any thoughts on structuring a synopsis? AIVF has
some thoughts, but not sure how relevant these are to Doc's, perhaps
more features based. I'm currently at concept stage, haven't begun
filming, but am looking to pitch to some production companies I've
targeted here in London.

Be really grateful for this.

This place is a godsend!

Rob, a synopsis is basically just a summary of what the film is
about, told as compellingly as you can. Can be anywhere from one or
two paragraphs to a couple of pages. There's no real formula to it,
but you should try and find some treatments that are on file
somewhere.

If you're in NY, visit the AIVF office: www.aivf.org. Or try an
organization like NYFA or Film/Video Arts that has been a fiscal
sponsor for many projects and would have proposals on file. Even if
you're not in NY, there should be a local organization in your nearest
city. Doesn't even have to be a film proposal to get the idea.

I meant some synopsis's on file, not treatments.

for synopsis - see TV guide.

thanks guys
once again, very helpful.

and I wouldn't send anyone a tape -ever.
The purpose of a tape is to allow distributors
to say we saw that - it's no good. You
need to take the trailer to a market, show
em that only, and make a deal or not. No
deal no show. The alternative is to take
the completed doc to an A list festival
and win a prize. Then let them approach
you with a deal.

Sending tapes out is the kiss of DEATH!

I'm just curious if the other 'working pros' out there agree with
this Statement of Robert's - and Robert, if you could back this up
with some examples or experience.

As someone who has made a few films, but hasn't had much
luck with broadcast, I'm still mystified by this idea. Why would a
broadcaster agree to buy a film if they haven't seen more than a
trailer?

thanks.

riley

Riley, there's a big difference between a trailer and a sample and
sometimes the terms can get confused. A trailer is basically a minute
or two long. A sample can be anywhere from a few minutes to, well,
almost any length. I helped produce a doc called "Silverlake Life"
and the sample was almost a half-hour. And very effective, too.

If you have a contact or previous experience with a broadcaster,
sending a cassette out is perfectly fine. If you don't, then a market
like the IFP's is better. But there aren't many like them out there.

Riley,

For confirmation please check a recent issue of the Independent Film
& Video Monthly - I think Dec/Jan with the Open City folks on the
cover. Jason and Joanna Kliot.
they wrote a piece about distribution that confirmed everything I've
learned and made the points i posted.

Dear Pros-
Is it necessary to secure "life story rights" for a documentary?
Is it ever kosher to pay a subject for appearing in a doc? The
subject of my film feels he needs some kind of compensation, beyond
publicity-- He also needs the money, which I totally understand.
Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks--

we all need money but paying for participation seems unethical to
most. What can and does happen is if the project is successful, the
participants share in the wealth, e.g., hoop dreams - the players
and parents received a share of the pie.

It's a very good idea to secure "life rights" because Small Wonders
becaming Playing with Strings with Meryl Streep and the life rights
holder benefited from Hollywood's interest after the doc was
successful.

Nothing wrong with the participant reaping much, if not all, of any
profits. Not that docs make profits ;-)

rarely or ever.

Robert- What are life rights? Is this something that all documentary
filmmakers need to get from their subjects?

Rhonda, as I understand it, life rights are rights to the life story
of the main character(s) in your doc, which are nice for you to secure
in writing in case someone wants to make a fiction film based on their
lives after seeing the documentary.

Not always easy to get. It brings up possible issues of the subjects
feeling exploited, so you should tread carefully and find out from an
entertainment lawyer how to go about it. Also, wouldn't do it unless
you feel your character and his or her situation is so compelling that
Hollywood is sure to come calling.

Thanks Doug. You are right about treading carefully. I'm just in
the beginning stages of production, so I won't deal with this until
further down the road. Speaking of an entertainment lawyer, is there
a difference between an entertainment lawyer and a producer's rep?
Also, is this the place on D-Word where I can ask specific questions
about my film-in-progress? This is my first film.

the lines are getting increasingly blurry with the john sloss types
out there doing both, but generally an entertainment lawyer is paid by
the hour and a producer's rep gets a percentage of any distribution
advance and, depending, other sales.

hi there, new to the board.
i am thinking of making a doc, i have very limited resources
in terms of money.just curious what is fair compensation for a main
character(s) in terms of percentages if the film makes any money?

it's your choice, jennifer. most doc makers don't give their
subjects a profit share. some give up to 50%. it all depends on your
relationship to the subjects, what they want, what you want to give,
etc.

just make it clear to them that the chances of making any profit is
excedingly small.

thanks doug! that helps!

Thanks Doug.You are a wealth of information and very generous in
sharing it! Which would you advise for someone like me? An
entertainment lawyer or a producer's rep?

Hi Doug, Just saw the list of Sundance grant recipients and saw you
just received a development grant. Congratulations! That's
wonderful!

thanks, rhonda. i'd recommend an entertainment lawyer until you're
confident your film will start a bidding war at sundance next year.
then, hey, give me a call ;-)

Thanks. Do you recommend any particular ones in NY?

Well, I like my lawyer, Robert Freedman: 212-974-7474. He's been
very involved with AIVF over the years and is very sympathetic to
indie filmmakers. Say hi from me.

Thanks Doug. Also, I called Fernanda Rossi, because I don't like my
demo reel and she was extremely helpful and knowledgable. I saw that
you mentioned her in this "Mentoring Room", and I trust your
referrals. She made some terrific suggestions and she's also
extremely nice. You are very hooked in to the documentary film scene
and are a wealth of knowledge. As I've mentioned,I'm making my first
film and I find your suggestions and this whole doc film site an
invaluable resource. (For other people reading this I am not related
to Doug, and I'm not earning any extra income from him for my
feedback, which he didn't ask for.)

Hi There!
First time filmmaker here, I want to begin shooting a documentary
about a club and the exotic dancers who work in the club, is there
any legal protocal I should follow in terms of releases, life story
rights, and location releases? Can anyone also recommend a book or
online website that would have similar legal contracts and releases?
Any info from you pro's would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in
advance!

jenn

Hi, Jennifer. I highly recommend you check out entertainment lawyer
Mark Litwak's website: http://marklitwak.com. Get releases from
everyone you can, including patrons whose faces are recognizable (good
luck!). Get a release from the club, absolutely. As for life rights,
it seems premature. I'd deal with that a little later down the line -
might spook your subject(s) unnecessarily.

Thank you so much Doug! Your advice is greatly appreciated!

Are you perchance the same Jennifer Fleming who worked on An American
Love Story?

Darn . . . there is another Jennifer Fleming filmmaker out there? No
Doug, I am not her. I am a first-time doc filmmaker - I wish I can
claim her experience instead of her name.
Thanks again for your help. I am certain that my questions will be
posting frequently over the next several weeks as I embark on this
storytelling journey. :)